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	<title>Comments on: Horns of a dilemma: I would really love to get that George Stubbs original painting for sale on ebay . . . but it just feels so wrong. (a rant)</title>
	<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant</link>
	<description>Art, Animals, and the Creative Experience</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 20 May 2012 11:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: MonaMajorowicz</title>
		<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9972</link>
		<dc:creator>MonaMajorowicz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 20:22:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9972</guid>
		<description>Hey Melanie,

Since we have a gallery we get all sorts of email from various overseas companies looking to sell their "excellent quality original paintings." (that's usually how it's phrased) I just delete them but I'm sure loads of galleries snap them up. Looking at their price point it's really hard not to. And I agree, from what I've read those who do the painting get paid nominally (of course they couldn't get paid high wages and still sell the work for nothing.) The "Honest trader" claims their place of origin is China so no doubts there.

I imagine my problem with ebay was trying to report something using their automated system. The more questions I answered the farther I got from the truth. Perhaps had I finished it to the end I could have made it make sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Melanie,</p>
<p>Since we have a gallery we get all sorts of email from various overseas companies looking to sell their &#8220;excellent quality original paintings.&#8221; (that&#8217;s usually how it&#8217;s phrased) I just delete them but I&#8217;m sure loads of galleries snap them up. Looking at their price point it&#8217;s really hard not to. And I agree, from what I&#8217;ve read those who do the painting get paid nominally (of course they couldn&#8217;t get paid high wages and still sell the work for nothing.) The &#8220;Honest trader&#8221; claims their place of origin is China so no doubts there.</p>
<p>I imagine my problem with ebay was trying to report something using their automated system. The more questions I answered the farther I got from the truth. Perhaps had I finished it to the end I could have made it make sense.</p>
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		<title>By: melanie</title>
		<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9964</link>
		<dc:creator>melanie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 08:21:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9964</guid>
		<description>We had a guy selling reproductions of Nicks horses on ebay, for like $11! Someone found them and emailed us and we immediately got them shut down, ebay were really good and actually the middle man (in the US) removed other ones of ours and took them down himself. He said he 'bought' them in bulk but couldn't give us any more info than that and im sure he just sold them somewhere else. 

The Chinese artists painted from our images from our website but I don't know how the system works, who finds the images and who organises everything, someone must not understand the word 'copyright' and its probably not the guys that actually paint the pictures. 

I don't know what the solution is but I know it will get worse and the market is being saturated with Chinese paintings and its the middle men to blame. I know of a couple of pet portraits websites, both sites promote 'their paintings' and I know for a fact they are bought in from china...although customers would not know this!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We had a guy selling reproductions of Nicks horses on ebay, for like $11! Someone found them and emailed us and we immediately got them shut down, ebay were really good and actually the middle man (in the US) removed other ones of ours and took them down himself. He said he &#8216;bought&#8217; them in bulk but couldn&#8217;t give us any more info than that and im sure he just sold them somewhere else. </p>
<p>The Chinese artists painted from our images from our website but I don&#8217;t know how the system works, who finds the images and who organises everything, someone must not understand the word &#8216;copyright&#8217; and its probably not the guys that actually paint the pictures. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know what the solution is but I know it will get worse and the market is being saturated with Chinese paintings and its the middle men to blame. I know of a couple of pet portraits websites, both sites promote &#8216;their paintings&#8217; and I know for a fact they are bought in from china&#8230;although customers would not know this!</p>
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		<title>By: MonaMajorowicz</title>
		<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9935</link>
		<dc:creator>MonaMajorowicz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Dec 2009 21:47:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9935</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Hey Undaunted&lt;/strong&gt;, I hope you're feeling better.

No they're actual paintings.  It is definitely reproducing existing work, but they are actually applying paint to canvas, so it is technically a "original" painting. From what I've read they like print out something on canvas or project. It is basically a glorified paint-by-number. But apparently they look quite good in person. So there you go. That's how they get the high ranking in customer satisfaction. It is so much easier to copy greatness, than to create greatness from scratch.

As to copying a dead artist, it's still not okay. I'm sure someone owns the image reproduction rights to the Mona Lisa. (Louvre?)  But 75 years after the death of an artist the inherent copyright of the artist become null, unless legal measures are in place. It's totally wrong to copy others work regardless of living or dead. But why I jumped to action with the living artist is that it definitely cuts into his profits. Not to mention incredibly annoying.
&lt;strong&gt;
Greetings Joni,&lt;/strong&gt; I agree that I doubt ebay would want to shut down Honest Darth. I mean 300 listings and I'm sure they are constantly rotated. He must make them a tidy sum even if they do all sell for only $58.

I agree that unless you have the money to pursue things legally it is almost useless to try to stop it. This is why I haven't gone to the trouble to get anything "officially" copyrighted. I have yet to see my work stolen, but I'm sure it has happened. Have you pursued any course of action when you find someone who has used your work illegally?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Hey Undaunted</strong>, I hope you&#8217;re feeling better.</p>
<p>No they&#8217;re actual paintings.  It is definitely reproducing existing work, but they are actually applying paint to canvas, so it is technically a &#8220;original&#8221; painting. From what I&#8217;ve read they like print out something on canvas or project. It is basically a glorified paint-by-number. But apparently they look quite good in person. So there you go. That&#8217;s how they get the high ranking in customer satisfaction. It is so much easier to copy greatness, than to create greatness from scratch.</p>
<p>As to copying a dead artist, it&#8217;s still not okay. I&#8217;m sure someone owns the image reproduction rights to the Mona Lisa. (Louvre?)  But 75 years after the death of an artist the inherent copyright of the artist become null, unless legal measures are in place. It&#8217;s totally wrong to copy others work regardless of living or dead. But why I jumped to action with the living artist is that it definitely cuts into his profits. Not to mention incredibly annoying.<br />
<strong><br />
Greetings Joni,</strong> I agree that I doubt ebay would want to shut down Honest Darth. I mean 300 listings and I&#8217;m sure they are constantly rotated. He must make them a tidy sum even if they do all sell for only $58.</p>
<p>I agree that unless you have the money to pursue things legally it is almost useless to try to stop it. This is why I haven&#8217;t gone to the trouble to get anything &#8220;officially&#8221; copyrighted. I have yet to see my work stolen, but I&#8217;m sure it has happened. Have you pursued any course of action when you find someone who has used your work illegally?</p>
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		<title>By: Joni Solis</title>
		<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9932</link>
		<dc:creator>Joni Solis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Dec 2009 18:17:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9932</guid>
		<description>Seems to me that if ebay makes it that hard to report a copyright ownership issue that they really don't want to do anything about counterfeit rip off problems like this -- they are probably making too much money from the bad guys to want to kick them all off ebay.

More than once I have found my horse logo designs posted on ebay and other sites, but unless you have money for lawyers I don't know what can be done. Luckily some people will remove the art once they are confronted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Seems to me that if ebay makes it that hard to report a copyright ownership issue that they really don&#8217;t want to do anything about counterfeit rip off problems like this &#8212; they are probably making too much money from the bad guys to want to kick them all off ebay.</p>
<p>More than once I have found my horse logo designs posted on ebay and other sites, but unless you have money for lawyers I don&#8217;t know what can be done. Luckily some people will remove the art once they are confronted.</p>
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		<title>By: Undaunted</title>
		<link>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9930</link>
		<dc:creator>Undaunted</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Dec 2009 15:30:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://mona.myartbliss.com/post/horns-of-a-dilemma-i-would-really-love-to-get-that-george-stubbs-original-painting-for-sale-on-ebay-but-it-just-feels-so-wrong-a-rant#comment-9930</guid>
		<description>Hmm, selling those as "originals" has got to be illegal, surely?  Although, they're obviously not originals at $58!!  Aren't they better described as reproductions?

It's an interesting thought you raise though - it's ok to copy a dead artist but not a living one.  I suppose that makes sense.  Everyone wants to own a classic, but a living person has got to earn a wage!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmm, selling those as &#8220;originals&#8221; has got to be illegal, surely?  Although, they&#8217;re obviously not originals at $58!!  Aren&#8217;t they better described as reproductions?</p>
<p>It&#8217;s an interesting thought you raise though - it&#8217;s ok to copy a dead artist but not a living one.  I suppose that makes sense.  Everyone wants to own a classic, but a living person has got to earn a wage!</p>
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